Interview with Beth Powning
Writing, publishing, and the power of words in New Brunswick.
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Summary
Jenna Morton and Beth Powning discuss the writer's duty to the reader, emphasising honesty, empathy, and creating a satisfying reading experience. Beth shares her experiences as a writer from New Brunswick, highlighting the importance of the relationship between the writer and reader, the importance of observation in writing, and the power of words - particularly in difficult times. She also discusses overcoming writer's block and shares her personal experience of acting as an ambassador for New Brunswick in a lot of ways, defending the region against offensive attitudes and stereotypes. Beth ends on a hopeful note, with the assertion that the New Brunswick literary world is expanding and seeing some recognition - particularly evidenced in community collaboration and the development of the regional publishing industry.
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Transcript
Jenna: Hello, and welcome to WordCraft.
Beth: Well, hello, Jenna. It's wonderful to be here.
Jenna: I'm really looking forward to this discussion for all kinds of reasons. One of them though is that we've been kind of starting these conversations with asking about when you first had that, that feeling that you were a writer. And when you really kind of felt the world saw you that way. And I know this is something that you've shared about even in your own writing. So I'm really curious to hear a little bit about your journey with thinking of yourself as a writer.
Beth: I started writing when I was eight years old. So I didn't really think of myself as a writer, I only thought of the reason why I was writing, which is that I wanted to create a world and be in that world. Because I was a reader. And I read all the time. So I was used to seeing the world in a kind of a narrative, fantastic way. So I started writing a story about myself going to Wales, to a...well, it wasn't me; it was a made up person, and there were ponies, and there was ocean and there was drama, and I just started writing. And I wrote that way through my whole childhood. And I then decided I would be an actor. And so when I started at Sarah Lawrence College, I was an acting major. But, then I shifted to being a writing major, a creative writing major. And so...I've just either written or been inside another person, as an actor, my whole life. And so that's the way I see and process the world. As to when I wanted the world to see me as a writer. That's so that's a long, long and complicated journey. I think, as a writer, you feel that if nobody's reading what you're writing, then there's a piece of the process missing. As an actor, as a photographer, as some of the other things I've done. There's always implicit in that there's an audience. But when you're a writer, you are alone. And I've always said to write to other writers, like if I'm giving a workshop, the reader completes the act, you aren't writing only for yourself; you are writing for the work to go out into the world. So that is a long, frustrating, a lonely journey that all of us take, I think.
Jenna: I think that's such an interesting way to look at it, though: that you're writing for the reader - that they're part of the process as well. But it's not that you're necessarily writing for the publisher, or for the industry, but just to have someone else as an audience.
Beth:That's exactly right. And that's a very important point you just made. You need - a writer needs - to be as honest as possible, in all ways. And if you're not, it will show through. And what I mean about that is, let me see...you see, I'm a storyteller. So I'm remembering a workshop I once took in London, England, where there was a man who said that he was writing because he wanted to become very wealthy. And almost everybody in the class burst out laughing. He was very angry with us, and He stormed out, and he and he didn't come back. Maybe that's an honesty in and of itself. You know, we could go places with this discussion. But when I'm writing, I am thinking of the reader, because I'm thinking that reading is a solitary act. Writing is a solitary act. And yet, when you're reading, you're aware of the person that wrote it. And when I write, I'm aware of the person that's going to read it, and I care about that person. And I think my care will show when the reader is reading it, because they will feel that I cared about them. So like right now, I'm on the third draft of a novel and just before we started this interview, I wrote down in a margin: "What does the reader need here; what is the reader wanting here?" Because I know, as a reader, when I'm reading, it's like eating something that is so delicious. And I'm loving it so much. And you know, I don't want it to end, I don't want to finish eating that chocolate tart - just the way you don't want to finish reading the book. But the writer is so responsible for that. It's a wonderful relationship, even though you might never know the person who's reading what you write.
Jenna: I was just thinking that, as you were talking, about what an intimate form of a relationship that is, but with two people who might never, ever meet.
Beth: Right! And then when you do meet the reader, the reader often, first of all, is quite certain that they know you very well - particularly if you've written memoir. And that's a little bit startling. You think, "Oh! this person...I've told a whole lot of things to this person about myself, and I know nothing about them." But usually, I find that readers are very respectful. And they respect that you did that. And they're grateful. And they're...they don't presume upon it. And with a novel, or, you know, with fiction, what's fascinating is that, you find that the reader has absorbed your characters, and made them theirs, and almost feel sometimes that they know your characters better than you do. Which is really interesting. Because, you know, for example, you can think of book clubs where people argue ferociously about, "Oh no! She wouldn't have done that," or, "No, that wouldn't have happened." And I've been to many a book club where my books are being discussed, and I'd sit there listening bemused and fascinated, because it means that I have created characters that are real enough so that people can talk about them as if they were real people.
Jenna: Thinking along those lines, what about the relationship you have with your characters then? Do you see them as people that you're in a relationship with as well?
Beth: Yes. I guess I do. I have to think about that a little bit. I respect them. You know, it's so funny I can think of when I first start to make somebody up. Like, let's say Mr. Fairweather in The Sister's Tale, and I think I first of all, I think there's a need for a certain character, you know, I'll think, "Josephine needs Mr. Fairweather." And so then I think, "Well, who is Mr. Fairweather?" Well, what is already existing in my mind [that] indicates that I need this kind of a person? He's probably this and he's probably that. And then as I begin to imagine him, it's like a kind of magic where things come in. And "Oh, well, I bet he's interested in the weather." Why do I think that I don't know, it'll just happen. He's interested in the weather. And then because he's interested in the weather, he becomes a certain kind of person who is very meticulous, and observant, and he's a note taker. And on and on, and on it goes. The character grows just from a seed. It's like planting a seed and a plant grows, and then you start to care for the plant. And so I watch this character growing, and then you know, you'll always hear writers say that they say things that you didn't think they would say, and I always wondered what that meant. And for me to explain that: it is that when I write, I sit there, and I wait, I literally put my hands over my face, I sit in front of my laptop, and I listen. I watch the scene I’ve created and I listen, and I wait. And somebody will say something. And I'll think, "Yes, oh, I heard that. I've got to write that down." So obviously, I made it up. But it comes from a part of your mind that you're not particularly controlling. And this is a very important part about being a writer is learning about that part of you. That is the deepest creative corner of yourself, that you can learn to listen to, and learn to wait for. It's like the dream part of your mind.
Jenna: I love that imagery: the dream part of your mind. Ah! I'm wondering what other bits of advice or encouragement you have for people who are listening who - whether they're at the very early stages of starting their writing journey, or have been writing for a while and are trying to find some spark or need some kind of resource - what are some of the things that that you turn to and that you draw from?
Beth: Let's see, the first thing that jumped into my mind is that I remember one time I was...There were very few times in my life when I've actually been, as we say, blocked. But I do remember one when I was kind of stuck, and I randomly picked up Shakespeare. And I read about the sails billowing, pregnant with the wind. And my mind - it just unlocked something in me to think of all that means: "a sail, pregnant with wind." And so reading poetry and somebody like a writer like Shakespeare, or even, you know, just reading. And calmly and lovingly waiting to see if something will excite you like that. My daily life sometimes feels very separate from my life when I sit down at my desk to work. And yet I know that all the time in my other life, I'm gathering things that I will use when I'm writing. So part of being an actor was being trained to be observant, I remember one of the exercises that we were given when I was taking acting training was this huge tray would be brought in with a whole bunch of stuff on it. And you had a certain amount of time to look at that tray, and then it was taken away. And then the teacher would say, "Okay, what did you see on the tray? What can you remember?" And we were being taught simply to observe, to look at people to see how they use their hands, to see the expression in their eyes when somebody else says something, to see their body language, to look at the texture of light. I think that's just what I do. That's why I'm a writer, I guess. And sometimes talking to another writer can really be very exciting. Particularly if you are not talking about, "Where did you get published?" or, "Do you have an agent?" No, those are things that can scare you and inhibit you. What you're talking about is, "Why are you writing a story about somebody hanging close on a clothesline? What, Where did that come from?" And the person will say, "Well, oh, it was an incredible day, you know. I saw this thing, and it made me think of this and that and..." you know. And you just...you can excite each other this way, by watching each other's process of creation.
Jenna: It's so true, even just listening to you describe, you know, the tray of items, I'm automatically taken back to my childhood, and someone doing that as like a party game. And, all those little things, like you say, just having a conversation with someone sparks, so many things. It's fantastic. I'm wondering if you could talk a little bit about what it means to be a writer living here in New Brunswick.
Beth: I've often thought that if I were living in Toronto, you know, I might be going to lots of literary events. I might, I would have the opportunity to. I would have had the opportunity of going to hear people read, going to plays, going to, you know, a lot of events where I would be seeing things at a remove - which is what you see when you see a play or something that's been transformed into art. I don't do that very much here. I am more apt to be in a situation where we needed some trees cut along a phone pole, and we happened to have friends who had two big workhorses. And he said, "Oh, I could come and cut those trees, and when I come, could I keep the horses there?" And so when he came, he cut a little area of the woods and put a little electric fence up. And so at night, I knew those big workhorses were nestling in the edge of the woods. And I mean that what I'm saying is, there are things that happen in New Brunswick that are so amazing that do not happen in other places. And I treasure these things. We have a very rich oral tradition. And when somebody says to you, "Remember the time that blah, blah, blah?" And you've heard the story 25 times and you love it, and you want somebody else to hear it, you say, "Yes, yes. Tell that one. Tell that one!" And so they tell the story and it's like yeah, wasn't that great? And you're all laughing and you're appreciating it again. There's a lot here that makes me want to write. And it's more...it's very direct; it has to do with the place itself. The place itself inspires me - not only geographically and culturally, but historically. And so that has really added to my 'Why' and how I write the perhaps another thing that goes into why I have begun writing historical, so called historical fiction - literary fiction that has to do with the past is what I would prefer to call it - is because even though I've lived here for over 50 years, I wasn't born here. I moved here when I was in my early 20s. But those childhood years of living in a place are really, really profound. Because when you're, you're little, you take in the world in a way that you never will, again. And so I had to learn a lot about living here. And it was a bit of a blank slate when I came.
Jenna: I'm wondering though, if you could talk a little bit, maybe about it from a career standpoint of what it has meant to be on the east coast of Canada, in New Brunswick, and whether that has had either highs or lows or different challenges in terms of your writing career.
Beth: Things have changed. I mean, I've been publishing for over 25 years. And things have changed a lot in that time. For example, I published my first book with Penguin, it was called Seeds of Another Summer, and then it was republished as Home, and Goose Lane now has the contract for that, and they're bringing it out in like a fourth edition or something. But after I published that book, I think that the publishers were a little astounded that this book had come out of New Brunswick. And they then came back at me and said, "Well, you know, there's quite a buzz going. There's kind of a buzz about maritime writers. We wondered if you could write a book about, you know, a nonfiction...book about those writers." And I was really, really offended. And I said, "What writers are you talking about?" They said, "Well, there's, there's a group of writers in Newfoundland." And I wrote back and said, "No, I don't know what you're talking about. But I'm a writer, and I live in the Atlantic provinces." And so obviously, they weren't considering me, or anybody in New Brunswick as interesting to write about. And, you know, I get - I'm getting all stirred up even saying this, because it was so offensive. And I've had to defend in those early years. I defend. I felt I was an ambassador for New Brunswick. And I would go I remember, being somewhere in Alberta, and somebody said, "Why do you live in New Brunswick? Why would you live there?" and saying, "Why wouldn't I live there? Why don't you live here?" You know? You know, just that kind of, "Ugh!" you know. We've all experienced this, I'm sure. And so I did feel a little bit like an outsider in the big world of publishing. David Adams, Richards was probably the only person that most people had heard of, who was a writer in New Brunswick. So I've had to deal with that and kind of fight for it, and be an ambassador for New Brunswick. And I've been really happy and glad to do that. But other than that, which is kind of just a general attitude that I'm sure is changing. Other than that, I haven't had any problems with being published. You know, the fact that I don't live in the center of the country, or an inner big city. It doesn't matter. In fact, I think it gives all of us who live here such rich material and such an interesting perspective, that we can be really happy about that.
Jenna: I think that's very true. And I think, though it's in large part because of the work of people like you who spent so much time being an ambassador, and not just making outside interests, stop and realise what's happening here, but really helping New Brunswickers take ownership of that and say, “Yeah, we have a lot of talent and we have something special, and we're going to celebrate it,” and I think we're starting to see the fruits of that now with what's happening in creative spaces in this province. And so I'm wondering if you could maybe just look ahead a little bit and tell me what's exciting you about what's happening in the province right now?
Beth: Well, when I - this is just amazing to me - but when I published my first book, I was in my 40s. I mean, and believe me, I wasn't not writing all those years. Sometimes, it makes me a little sad that I didn't get published earlier, because I would have been able to, you know, have more books out there. But we were working really hard at a lot of things to get established. And so I couldn't write full time. But when I was published, I had never been to an author reading. I didn't even know they existed. I didn't know what it was, [to] go hear, an author read. That didn't exist. And we've started here in Sussex, [at] the Ax [Gallery] which is the Sussex Arts and Culture Center. I've been on the literary committee there since it started. And we have brought to Sussex, Giller Prize winners, international authors, poets, New Brunswick authors, the writer in residence at UNB. We've affiliated with the Frye Festival; we've affiliated with the Lorenzo Society. You know, the people here now have the opportunity of hearing all kinds of writers. We've done Writers in Translation... It's just - and that's happening in Moncton in Fredericton, in Saint [John and], many other small places the size of Sussex - other arts and culture centres around. So my view of the future for writers in New Brunswick is great. There's a whole lot more interest, the Writers' Federation is doing a terrific job with WordSpring and Fall Spring [WordsFall] and doing workshops. And there are so many more...small and vibrant and good publishers now. As opposed to, you know, a monolithic scene with big publishers, those smaller publishers are interested in the voices from here. So I think things are great.
Jenna: That's fantastic. Is there anything else that you'd like to leave us with in this discussion?
Beth: The power of the word. The power of the word is so strong. And life is so difficult right now, for so many reasons. And there's so much facing us as human beings on the planet right now. And sometimes I think, you know, these "shoulds" come in, like I should be writing about, you know, climate issues or whatever. But no. We have to continue to be creative people and put our hearts and souls into what we believe in and we'll be very much about communicating and listening. And writing is at the heart of that. So I think we're in a in a really important profession right now.
Jenna: I think that's a lovely sentiment to end this discussion on for today. Thank you so much Beth.
Beth: Well, thank you Jenna. It's so lovely to have somebody ask me these questions that I love to answer.
Jenna: Thank you.
